Clarifications for SB

[martin goddard]

Having played a bit of SB recently I have made a list of things that  I feel need mentioning in order to clarify the game.
These are not changes but things that I believe can easily be forgotten

The task
A . Have I said it correct?
B. What else can we add to help players.


Clarifications?
14th October 2022


1.   When an infantry or cavalry unit falls to just half a base it is removed from the game. It has disintegrated.
2.   Units can shoot diagonally for 1 square of range. This shooting cannot be between 2 objects ( scenery, units etc).
3.   A support square can be claimed if a square contains any bases at all. This would include just half a base too.
4.   Each unit must finish all of its movement before another unit is considered.
5.   The score need for higher command orders is the same or greater than the distance from higher command to square.  one diagonal is allowed. Scenery and other interventions make no difference.
6.   Squares can be temporarily overfilled  whilst movement is happening.
7.   Artillery can shoot over intervening units.
8.   Defences count full effect from all direction except the rear.
9.   Once a first unit is committed to an assault the inability of other units to join it cannot stop the assault.

Thank you

martin

[Moggy]

Thanks Martin

Just a clarification to the clarifications:

No1 says when a unit get down to half a base it disintegrates and is removed but point 3 says support can be given by a unit that is half a base strong. Can you clarify which it is?

Cheers

Derek

[martin goddard]

Good point Derek
The half base might be a half MG or artillery gun.

1.   When an infantry or cavalry unit falls to just half a base it is removed from the game. It has disintegrated.
2.   Units can shoot diagonally for 1 square of range. This shooting cannot be between 2 objects ( scenery, units etc).
3.   A support square can be claimed if a square contains any bases at all. This would include a half  base MG or damage gun/  armoured car too.
4.   Each unit must finish all of its movement before another unit is considered.
5.   The score need for higher command orders is the same or greater than the distance from higher command to square.  one diagonal is allowed. Scenery and other interventions make no difference.
6.   Squares can be temporarily overfilled  whilst movement is happening.
7.   Artillery can shoot over intervening units.
8.   Defences count full effect from all direction except the rear.
9.   Once a first unit is committed to an assault the inability of other units to join it cannot stop the assault.

[Colonel Kilgore]

Once we're done on this, we can post them as an "enduring" set of clarifications in the relevant thread.

There is something else at the back of my mind about a damaged / half-base MG that I think is different to point #3 below. Any ideas?

Simon

[martin goddard]

Not sure Simon.
Someone can pass light on this??
I will include these clarifications in pdf  SB and put it on the website too, along with the downloads



martin

[Camulogene]

Hello Martin,

I am very surprised by Point 3, because we always played in accordance to the rule specified page 50 : "Artillery and MG do not count as support", although I always thought it a bit weird and frustating, as the role of artillery and MGs is precisely supporting other troops...

So, can you please confirm that ANY KIND of base can count as a support?

Thanks in advance,

Pierre

[Moggy]

ROFLMAO.

sorry Martin, did I open a can of worms for you.

Derek

[Forst22]

I thought support squares need "more than 1 base in total" see page 49, notes bullet point 3?

[martin goddard]

ROFLMAO    what does that stand for Derek? Not seen that one.

Don't worry Derek you have not opened anything.
It was martin who put out a list of items to be corrected and commented on.
It is an "open session" on getting clarifications listed down.

I think that Pierre is correct.
As I said . It has been a long time since I played.
Hence why  I thought some clarifications would be really useful.
Obviously a good idea.

Keep the comments coming and it will help us get a list of useful clarifications.
If it gets to 40 or more then that is still fine.
Do add any thoughts that will be useful to players too.
It is often too easy to forget details and mechanisms.

I will keep re publishing the list until we all think it is useful.
Thanks for the input so far.

martin

[martin goddard]

1.   When an infantry or cavalry unit falls to just half a base it is removed from the game. It has disintegrated.
2.   Units can shoot diagonally for 1 square of range. This shooting cannot be between 2 objects ( scenery, units etc).
3.   A support square can be claimed if a square contains a total of 1.5 base or more. Do not include MG and artillery.
Damaged tanks and AC count as half bases. Support squares still count, even if they are involved in their own fight, withdrawal  etc.
4.   Each unit must finish all of its movement before another unit is considered.
5.   The score need for higher command orders is the same or greater than the distance from higher command to square.  one diagonal is allowed. Scenery and other interventions make no difference.
6.   Squares can be temporarily overfilled  whilst movement is happening.
7.   Artillery can shoot over intervening units.
8.   Defences count full effect from all direction except the rear.
9.   Once a first unit is committed to an assault the inability of other units to join it cannot stop the assault.
10. Higher command can move left or right, but that will prevent it using any command rolls that turn.



martin

[Forst22]

Not sure why Artillery and MG,s don't count in total for Support Squares? Have so far assumed they could,!

The rules say trenches have reduced effect if attacked from flank or rear?

Hasty defences only if attacked from rear?

[SimonC]

1.   When an infantry or cavalry unit falls to just half a base it is removed from the game. It has disintegrated.

Not in the rules.

2.   Units can shoot diagonally for 1 square of range. This shooting cannot be between 2 objects ( scenery, units etc).

Correct  - as long as the scenery has 'an effect on shooting' in the LOS of sight section

3.   A support square can be claimed if a square contains any bases at all. This would include just half a base too.

Its has to be more than 1 base to count. In answer to the MG and ART, there is a decrepancy here ... It doesn't say this in the rules, but does mention it in a diagram. We normally allow MGs in support its a great support weapon - and it makes no sense. As its RAW... if not RAI :-)

4.   Each unit must finish all of its movement before another unit is considered.

We normally play that yes.

5.   The score need for higher command orders is the same or greater than the distance from higher command to square.  one diagonal is allowed. Scenery and other interventions make no difference.

Correct

6.   Squares can be temporarily overfilled  whilst movement is happening.

Correct. You can leave it overfilled - but your opponent gets to push which ones we wants back a square towards your baseline (p41)

7.   Artillery can shoot over intervening units.

This is not clear , and you clarified in the FAQ Martin here - https://rulesforcommonman.uk/index.php?topic=392.0
So that is how we play it

8.   Defences count full effect from all direction except the rear.

Hasty Defences - Yes

9.   Once a first unit is committed to an assault the inability of other units to join it cannot stop the assault.

Correct... if by committed you mean 'leaves the square' to assault. Once one is in there is no stopping


Note there is a FAQ already for SB so any 'new' items can go there

https://rulesforcommonman.uk/index.php?topic=392.0

[Panzer21]

Martin asked:

"ROFLMAO    what does that stand for Derek? Not seen that one."

Rolling On Floor Laughing My A**e Off

Neil

[martin goddard]

Thank you Neil. I need to get in touch with popular culture more(?)

Thank you Simon. Lots of info there.   I will get that sorted and come back with  a new set of thoughts.
We will get there.

PBI games for me tomorrow though.


martin

[Sean Clark]

if machine guns dont provide support then i cant see the point in playing the game tbh

Julian

Whilst I agree that thematically  it would seem appropriate to allow MGs to count as support, Ive played the game for many years and enjoyed it wothout counting them.