ACW Epic?

[Leslie BT]

Ok so what's the opinion of the new release of the Warlord Epic ACW range and what are the ideas behind the range?

Is this competition for 15mm metal figures or good to get more people interested in the ACW and playing war-games?

They are a very different style of war-games figures.  So what are the thoughts?

[martin goddard]

My thoughts are only my own.

I think they are making a "whole new game" in terms of figures, rules and marketing.
It is probably aimed at creating  a new cadre of ACW players playing Warlord ACW.
This seems to have worked well for their cruel seas and black sails ranges.
It works for them so that is good all round.


These new players will get all their stuff from Warlord.  Good marketing.
It will have no effect for better or worse on PP ACW sales.


martin

[John Watson]

I am very cynical about Warlord Games. They seem to like producing game systems that appear to be like existing ones, but when you look closely they just don't quite fit. So you either have to go with their system in totality or not. So Cruel Seas, Black Seas, Victory At Sea and ACW Epic all feature models that are incompatible with other ranges either due to their base type or because of the scale of the models differing from those already available. I will confess to having invested in Cruel Seas but I have not touched the others. I think Victory At Sea is a particular con as the game rules already existed for use at 1/2400 or 1/3000 scale. So they have republished with their own "stamp" in 1/1800 scale.
ACW Epic figures seem to be another use by Warlord Games of their own scale. I'm not sure they broadcast exactly what scale they are, but they seem to be somewhere between Kallistra's 12mm and commonly available 15mm such as PP, Essex etc.
Not for me thanks.
John

[Leslie BT]

So John what will be your comments when they move to make ancient's for 'Epic', again in their own scale and style. But again with lots of publicity and marketing, will they not attract new players to the period?
You have picked 'Cruel Sea's' as have a number at the Carantan club and I have joined in with the games. I have not bought into the game but could see the reasons that many would. The games are well presented, the rules are easy to understand, the models and game components attractive.

I agree with Martin it is a new system and will create a new following. It is a new look at the whole way of model making creating large armies at a very low cost using a rule system that is already tried and tested.
If it gets more younger players into historical gaming it must be good.

PP try very hard to attract new younger players into the historical hobby, and so long as they do not feel they are baby sitting will engage young players with enthusiasm, and hopefully some do get hooked on the hobby.
When I have been with our 54mm gaming group we always try to get younger players involved. And this is often at events that may not be war gaming events.
Hopefully some of these may get into war gaming but probably not in 54mm though, but any new recruit is good for the hobby.

[Noggin]

Cant say that I will be interested in them. I already have hundreds of 15mm ACW for CWB and TCHAE as well as 10mm for AoF. I suppose that it is a way of introducing people to a period and gaming as a whole at a reasonable cost. I don't know much about theses figures or the rule system though.

[John Watson]

Les my beef with Warlord is that they produce games that are incompatible with others. It would be like Martin re-casting all his figures as, say, 22mm. that way they won't mix with anything.
John

[Moggy]

There is a look at the figures on the Warlord games facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/WargamesIllustrated/ ) showing the figure together with Kallistra figures.

There appear to be very slightly bigger then those.  As I subscribe to wargames illustrated and this months cover "gift" is a sprue of the figures I have used my monthly£5 voucher for some as the ones available to member have already gone. I couldn't find anything else there I wanted so have ordered 2 copies of the magazine for 2 sprues for £9 in total including the postage.  That's a dammed sight cheaper than the ones appearing on EBAY at the moment. They seem to be going for that price each.

As I dont have ACW in anything apart from some very old 6mm stuff I may just see how they compare, sizewise" with PP stuff. If its too far out I may do one side in just that together with some Kallistra (6 pack for the cost of 5) and see how it goes. Will still have to get CWB rules though. Can't be robbing Martin's retirement fund too much.

Still have 2 WW1 armies to get done first though. Thats going to be a big job before I start another one.

Derek

[pbeccas (Paul)]

My opinion.  Everyone will go crazy and buy the starter box.  No-one will actually paint the 2000+ figures inside.

[Smiley Miley 66]

The Victory at Sea game is a combination of 2 things that were out there already. The rules have been out there for a few years now. From what I can gather can be scaled up or down very easily. I know the 1/1800 ships were around for sometime as well, I remember seeing them at the Weymouth show one year when it was at the Pavilion. I think it was Mongoose that might have been involved with one or the other or both ?
Someone out there might be able to correct or confirm it ?
Miles.

[martin goddard]

The problem (if it is one) for makers of "just our size" is that there are so many sizes out there one of them is likely to match.
In this size band there is 2mm,3mm, 5mm,6mm,7mm, 9mm,10mm, 12mm,15mm,18mm,20mm. Perrys tried the 8mm with Napoleonic but that was not expanded.

Starting a new size would have to take into account the possible opposition.
1. Is it so bad that it can be ignored?
2. Could a campaign be launched to convince that nothing can go with the "only buy me" size? 3. 3. Maybe a starter set that is so big that the customer becomes committed? I have spent this much so I might as well continue.

Peter Pig did this with the 1/450th pirate ship range.
I made up a scale that gave ships of the "suits me" tactile size.
Because the range was very specific in its ambition it has worked well for 25 years.
However "worked well" is probably microscopic compared to the output of larger companies.

martin

[Leslie BT]

I agree John. Just look what has happened to GW when they pick their own scales and model sizes.

[Leslie BT]

Epic should be shipping over the next few days.

[Moggy]

Just grabbed a Confederate Brigade on Ebay for £13.70 (well below RRP). I intend to cut the the strips down to  30mm bases so that may be 4 or 5 abreast depending on how crowded a base will look and see how they compare, size wise, with PP figs.  Not sure if I will do 1 or 2 deep. Even so that should get me around 100 bases of infantry which is more than enough I should think for now.  I am amazed how expensive their booster boxes (cav, dismounted cav, skirmishers, gun limbers) are. I have noted form a few vids on UTube how many people think the samer. And they have just added a price rise as well. 

Depending on the look, for size, all the other stuff I need (see in brackets above) will come from PP. If the difference in size is too great may well be Kallistra.  I will post some comparision piccies once I have a couple based.

Derek

[Sean Clark]

There is a chap on YouTube, vlogging his progress with Epic ACW and he uses Peter Pig to supplement what's in the big box. Price wise, there's no comparison for those expansions. Peter Pig are way cheaper.

[Moggy]

Not at £13.70 for 1000 infantry. OK, going to have to do some work splitting them up and they are almost all in the same pose but .......   .Thank god for the 3 foot rule.

As I said, the remainder of the troops needed to make an army will probably come from PP anyway as I like them.

Derek