Residual Dice

[Leman (Andy)]

This is actually a question as I do not play Fighting for Mexico, time and finances both being against me starting a new period. Consequently, when Xavier mentioned using residual dice in his Walter Schnaff's game, in Mill 16, I had no idea what he meant by it or how a residual die/dice works. Can somebody please explain?

[martin goddard]

I think I know what Pierre is referring to.

If an army has an asset of 7. Once the 7are all used they are gone.

If residual rule is applied.

If an army has an asset of 7. Once they are used there is always a 1 remaining (residual). This means that the asset  is still/always available but at a small chance. It helps keep the opponent "on edge", knowing that the feared asset has not totally disappeared.

At the moment only PBI 2020 has this feature.


martin

[Leman (Andy)]

Thanks Martin.

[Smiley Miley 66]

It's a very good option, as we all know it's a 1 in 6 chance of getting, some games it works well another game it just fizzles away !
Miles

[Leman (Andy)]

I think I shall employ it as most of my games are quite small and it could add some extra spice to the game.

[martin goddard]

The danger  I can see is that a valuable asset can still keep happening even when the original asset amount is spent. This makes a valuable asset happen too much???
This  is true in PBI 2020. To compensate  for this, the HE asset counts double in victory point  assessments


martin

[Colonel Kilgore]

Is it really likely to happen that often, Martin?

I would have thought that in the first 3 or 4 turns players would be using actual asset points. If a game lasts 6 turns each, that's 2 or 3 chances at scoring a 6 on one D6. So a 33% or 50% chance, respectively. Not great odds.

And HE is likely to be less useful at a later stage in the game anyway, as the forces are typically so near to / mixed in with each other.  So a real "danger close" situation.

Simon

Simon

[Leman (Andy)]

I assumed there was only ONE residual die and that's how I would play it.

[Camulogene]

Hi,

The residual rule is also in Fighting for Mexico (page 45).

We played it several times, and I don't remember that it was too much; on the contrary It's AMHA a good option, and not exessive odds as Simon pointed out.

Pierre

[martin goddard]

The one residual is for all the chosen assets.
ie all assets in SB/FM but only the chosen ones in PBI.

I have benefitted several times from an extra HE. In PBI it made a lot of difference for me. 4 Squares pinned down plus some kills too. Because it is so useful players tend to choose HE all the time and not flex into other assets.  Hence PBI will reduce the initial HE by 1 in complete 3.  e.g 8 becomes 6.

Some might howl a bit but the evidence will be in whether players still use HE or not. I suspect they will still use HE but complain none the less.  "HE is now not worth having but as a favour to my opponent I will continue to use it anyway.".

The reduction might reduce how often HE is-used and could hopefully  nudge players into more variety??


martin

[SimonC]

If an army has an asset of 7. Once they are used there is always a 1 remaining (residual). This means that the asset  is still/always available but at a small chance. It helps keep the opponent "on edge", knowing that the feared asset has not totally disappeared.

I'm not sure I like it that much for SB. Given you might normally only get 2 good chances of a barrage in a game, and then looking at all the poor relatives for the remainder of the game. It also really offsets the asset re-roll.

you would get 16% + re-roll 1,2,3 fishing again  ... close to 20% of getting a barrage every go.  If your dice go hot could be a bit OOT

[martin goddard]

Don't worry Simon.
The residual and 1 in 3 HE is strictly PBI.
SB works very differently.


Only PBI and FM have a residual asset.
SB does not.

It is just some  thing that Pierre is trying out.  Good luck to him.


martin

[Smiley Miley 66]

HE is a good asset. When up against stubborn defenders it is very useful.
As everyone says the odds are usually stacked against getting (6) 3 times in game ?
My British against your Japs ? But another game comes along, and I can't roll (6)s for toffee ! As you kept pointing out ! Even with 10 plus dice in my hand ?
So your going to penalise the ones with " slightly better artillery" just because using Artillery is a slightly more modern tactic(WW2) of dislodging stubborn resistance?
In the end it is pure luck with the Residue Dice.
The other way of stopping or cutting down the use of one particular Asset. What about like a lot of other games opening out the Assets chart instead of just 3, add in all the possible assets ?
Then that would justify lowering the asset totals ?
Miles

[martin goddard]

Don't worry Miles, 1 in 3 affects everyone the same because it is proportional.

The need for a 6 is deliberately erratic.
That means you are correct Miles. You might roll lots of D6 and not get a 6 or, roll few D6 and get a 6.
Overall more D6  create a  better chance than fewer D6.

The question is:-
Will this change encourage players to use other assets instead of HE?
The reason behind choosing 3 assets is for players to make a tactical choice.
Success should depend on  players making a choice.

We need to find the balance at which players  think
"Maybe I will use a sniper/dug in/gifted leader  instead of HE".
Rather than the more usual
" I will always use HE"

If there is one asset players always choose then there is a problem.



martin

[Colonel Kilgore]

Here's an idea. I'm sure it will please 🙂

Regardless of the actual or residual asset points, any given asset can never be "won" more than a set number of times in a game. Let's say twice.

This could encourage folk to think more about their other assets, while limiting the effect of the "better" ones (which I think most agree that HE currently is).

Simon