Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Author Topic: The 15 Mill  (Read 1135 times)

martin goddard

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1983
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #90 on: November 10, 2018, 08:28:54 PM »
Job done Simon
Next?

Leslie BT

  • Supporter 2018
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #91 on: November 10, 2018, 08:31:18 PM »
Duncan the size of figures, how and where you measure to is a discussion as old as war-game figures.

Look back to the Airfix and early war-games and modeling magazines.

Is has more to the style of the figure than any exact measurement.

Leslie BT

  • Supporter 2018
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #92 on: November 10, 2018, 08:34:17 PM »
Radar.

I look forward to play testing your additions to ROF.

Leslie BT

  • Supporter 2018
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #93 on: November 10, 2018, 08:36:15 PM »
Duncan.

I am looking forward to reading your article on the production of snow terrain as was done for the last big PBI game.

Radar

  • Supporter 2018
  • Wild Boar
  • *
  • Posts: 165
    • View Profile
    • Keep Your Powder Dry
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #94 on: November 10, 2018, 08:56:26 PM »
Radar.

I look forward to play testing your additions to ROF.
My additions ? :o
It was an act of managerial blue sky thinking. Surely the industrial behemoth that is the Peter Pig Empire® has 'people' to do such things?  ;)

Colonel Kilgore

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 2064
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #95 on: November 10, 2018, 09:35:32 PM »
My additions ? :o
It was an act of managerial blue sky thinking. Surely the industrial behemoth that is the Peter Pig Empire® has 'people' to do such things?  ;)

Which is precisely how you've just earned yourself an invitation to author said piece  8)

Radar

  • Supporter 2018
  • Wild Boar
  • *
  • Posts: 165
    • View Profile
    • Keep Your Powder Dry
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #96 on: November 10, 2018, 09:46:10 PM »
Bum!

sjwalker51

  • Piglet
  • *
  • Posts: 36
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #97 on: November 10, 2018, 11:30:51 PM »
“My initial thoughts are ; if a company calls its stuff "15mm" then it is a good candidate for the "15mill". If it calls itself "18mm" then probably not. Of course this still allows for a lot of approximation, but that can be said in the reviews or by the company themselves. It is the statement "15mm" that matters most of all.”

Sorry but I think that would be counter-productive: real “People’s Front of Judea “ stuff. As previously mentioned, the whole ‘scale/size’ debate has been going on for 30+ years, and if you really want to challenge the 25/28mm bias of the hobby, then the 15/18mm manufacturers can not afford to get ‘cliquey’ or ‘sizeist’.

By all means point out that PP, OG and BM figures aren’t necessarily going to look good alongside each other, definitely have a PP-bias in the new newsletter (or what ever you decide to call it) but don’t hesitate to praise ‘competitors’ when they cover a period well, especially when there’s no conflict of interest with PP ranges.

And, if 15mm is going to gain any traction, it’s essential to push ranges for Wars that are not currently well covered in the scale and/or which lend themselves to ‘bigger battles’ that just don’t look good in the larger scales but which also feature enough smaller actions that encourage characterisation where the mass appeal of 6/10mm is not so apparant - hence my requests for a WW1 Africa range extension, Arab Revolt or Mexican Revolution packs, for example.

Sean Clark

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1269
  • In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king
    • View Profile
    • Buckets of Dice
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #98 on: November 11, 2018, 06:44:10 AM »
 Thinking caps on then.

1. Do we have regular sections? So Editorial, news, battle report of the month, new releases?
2. Or just whatever people feel like producing and a more ad hoc approach?


I like the idea of a mini game, with a pack of figures to paint and small set of rules to develop. Lots of possibility. French Indian War, Robin Hood, Mexican Revolution....its endless really.


Smiley Miley 66

  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 331
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #99 on: November 11, 2018, 09:26:24 AM »
There should be a structure, a backbone of said articles that will make a regular appearance ? Then an allowance for and ad hoc articles to appear ? But knowing Martin this is already under control !

martin goddard

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1983
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #100 on: November 11, 2018, 10:03:57 AM »
The 18mm matter is important.  Certainly worth discussion. Here are my thoughts for what they are worth.


The 25 to 28mm size was made by Foundry/Perry in order to create a new market that excluded others. In that case all the other (bar a few) companies instantly re-named their figures as 28mm. Dixon were 25mm in June but 28mm in July.  A seeming waste of time for the 28mm inventors then?

Those companies  that chose 18mm did so purely to diminish 15mm. They wished to create a new size that folk could not mix with the existing 15mm companies. Their splitting of 15mm has caused a lot of damage to both 15mm and their new size of 18mm.

PP figures certainly vary in size. PP figure  ranges are complete, in that other company products are not vital. An additional option yes, but not vital.  So we could have gone with 17mm or 16mm but chose not to, in order to preserve a wide ranging 15mm industry. An holistic approach that looks to the future benefit to many?

The choice of 18mm is much much nearer to 20mm than 15mm. It is 20% larger than 15mm. It is 10% smaller than 20mm.  Therefore they need to be promoted by 20mm forums.

Of course they might start re-naming their stuff 15/18mm in order to get more customers and backtrack.
But it remains the case (as i see it)  that these folk are trying to diminish 15mm sales in order to enhance their own.
If players build a 15mm army and mix PP, Essex, minifigs et al, then I think that all benefit. If a new company comes up with better figures in 15mm than PP, then players can buy those and upgrade their armies.

It is common for makers to design their products so that you have to buy it all over again at regular intervals (GW?, FOW etc). PP products allow a player to use their existing items to play the games as those games are re-vamped.

I prefer to state 15mm as being a worthwhile size. Thus encouraging new companies to launch ranges called 15mm, rather than muddy the waters and confuse potential gamers. If we do not promote 15mm then 18mm just confuses gamers and deflates the interest in "those guys that cannot make their minds up about what size they are making".

Others may feel differently and that is as it should be.

martin goddard

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1983
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #101 on: November 11, 2018, 10:10:50 AM »
Miles
All is fluid . This will help the magazine be easy to put together. It would be better to put in four battle reports and not have a scenery article, rather than force an ad hoc scenery article and put in one battle report to maintain format.
The major problem with this project is to keep it rolling forward after all the initial enthusiasm has found other directions of travel.
If it survives a year then that is most promising.
Once again the watchword is "pragmatism". Do see my previous notes on potential nay-sayers.

Sean Clark

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1269
  • In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king
    • View Profile
    • Buckets of Dice
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #102 on: November 11, 2018, 10:18:42 AM »
Shall we get writing? I'm in my research phase at the moment but will but pen to paper soon.

martin goddard

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1983
    • View Profile
Re: The 15 Mill
« Reply #103 on: November 11, 2018, 11:24:58 AM »
Yes please , get writing everyone. Whatever you want but try to make it 15mm relevant.

martin goddard

  • RFCM Admin Supporter
  • Hog the Limelight
  • *
  • Posts: 1983
    • View Profile
The 15 Mill
« Reply #104 on: November 11, 2018, 11:58:40 AM »
This project is going so fast I cannot keep up!  Excellent.
I suggest we have aboard dedicated to the 15 Mill We could always delete it if the project fails.
If anyone wants to get started on some work here is what i suggest.
I am of course open to better methods, but tis should get us started.

1. Send it to me as an attachment  peterpig@btinternet.com and put THE 15MILL in capitals within the heading.
2. Please do it as a WORD  or RTF formatted file. Where pictures should go just put "PICTURE HERE" or similar.   Do not send in pdf as we might need to bend it around other articles and pages.
3. Send the pictures in any format as attachments. If you put them within the article it might get mashed up.
4. Do put your proper name on it unless you require anonymity, then put a cipher or similar.
5. Once the article is submitted it becomes part of the 15Mill and cannot be retracted. Amendments can of course be sent in. Being on the line the magazine can easily be updated. An article cannot be withdrawn as it messes up an edition.
6. I suggest no photos of faces with names attached. The internet is searched by some unusual persons with unusual motives.  So a group of folk with first names is good, but maybe not a listing of full names?
7. Assume, at present, that the 15Mill will be straight formatted with no columns.
8. The Editors (multiple) will have free rein to change the formatting, font etc.   But will really try hard not interfere with your work.  Maybe a comment accredited to the editor.
9. There will not be lengthy back and forward editorial meetings.
10. There is no payment or writer rights in the magazine.
11. Be careful about including any pictures that were made by someone else. They need to say yes in a proper e mail, not phone chat.
12. There is no arbitrary "level" of production.  You do it and in it goes!  Obviously watch out for offence of normal folk. But be re-assured whatever you do will offend someone.
13. No links to transitory sites such as facebook or news headlines which may disappear within 18 months. You will need to make your own judgements on this one. Not fun to read an article that sends the reader to non- existent sites.
14. Maybe we should print off a few to be put in shops etc.

14-16 don't know yet!